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#10424949 Dec 18, 2014 at 03:34 PM
Mythic Raider
24 Posts
I was just trying to wrap my head around what you were trying to say. I was grabbing numbers from wow head spell abilities and just doing super rough math and thought I'll post it up and see how it flies.... obviously not well.

the 25 people was for the size of the raid group (according to wowhead) because of the damage scaling. Also I think you misinterpret arguing and just trying to have a discussion.

Wind and I both said almost any time you bring up the cleave damage, but it appears we're wrong about that.

Sorry to say though but at the moment you are actually wrong and as a DPS maybe you should maybe refrain from commenting in areas where you have no direct relevant experience such as healing H butcher??

Maybe no one should just say anything that might help the raid kill stuff then. Maybe only 4 people in the group should have the only input and the rest of us just sit there like mindless peons and do as we are told. I'm, sure that's going to help us for when we get farther in progression.

Just because I play dps doesn't mean I don't understand how fights work for other players man, remember imp and ko ragh, I "only a DPS" helped quite a bit in there right? It just means that this particular part of a fight I thought you were wrong, and that's obviously not the case.

I really hope these posts about strat discussion don't turn into an argument, I was simply offering my idea, and my reasoning and you had better reasoning and I see now that you're way is better.
#10424999 Dec 18, 2014 at 03:58 PM · Edited over 2 years ago
Mythic Raider
1791 Posts
I think there should be open discussion, I've actually had almost zero input into strategy this tier other than for Heroic butcher. In fact there isn't much discussion in officer either usually with I would prefer wasn't the case.

The forum is the place to iron these things out and I'm glad this wasn't a waste of time. I didn't realise the Cleave was hitting for up to 150K for each hit with 4 stacked either - that itself makes the case for more in the stack for heroic and could have given us a quicker solution if i had seen that.

Honestly, keep it up. If you are wrong about something on here then no harm done, but personally I'd like Raids to not be a strategy debate, with these things figured out before hand. That's the exact reason i posted about this one because i knew it would be a problem coz teh vidz show 4 stacked.

we just have to remember for many of those early vids that everyone treats like gospel, REALLY good players are making it work, but they have not had time to discover methods which make it easier on them yet.

i actually thought you did a good job raid leading. did you notice though that very few people talked over you or argued strategy? we just went with something and it worked well. The only advice i can give you is that you TRY to return the same respect to whoever is leading because to be honest, it does get on their nerves a bit when you talk over them. Lets also not be so quick to shoot down other people when they had input on strategy (you did it a few times in raid so i though ok then I'll shut up!)

It probably sounds harsher on here ok? i just like to get stuff out in the open and sorted before raids so nobody is wondering. I (and the officers) do actually really appreciate the extra mile you have gone to help us via learning the ropes in pugs.

And yeah I could just have as easily been wrong on Butcher because i was initially going primarily on how it felt to me as a healer which logs seemed to back up with a rough investigation.

For me strategy can be a heated topic which then stresses me out. Part of the reason i was sitting back a bit more this tier. Butcher is one fight where if we hope to down it tonight where this discussion was needed....

So all good? hopefully no harm done. I've got a history of going nuts on yeh *fingers crossed*

(I'm trying to be less of a carndt...)

#10425072 Dec 18, 2014 at 04:33 PM
Mythic Raider
24 Posts
Definitely man, inflexion is so hard to tell over print. I get heated too, raiding is the only reason I play this game so when we don't do well it frustrates me.

If I was shooting people down I hope it was because their strat wouldn't work because of XYZ reasons and I wasn't just being an asshole. If a strat was good and I shot it down I apologize, but I have a knack for learning strats quickly (except butcher healing apparently ;) ) and understanding why certain things wont work.

I'll try and limit the interrupting during strats, but the 250+ mumble Ms makes it hard, I think there is a break so I go to chime in but someone starts talking because of lag lol.

Let's go back to being besties xoxo x<3
#10425102 Dec 18, 2014 at 04:45 PM
Mythic Raider
1791 Posts
i think we worked this out pretty well in the end *team hug*

I do find it hard sometimes. I'm a pretty serious kind of person and want to take raiding seriously, but time and real life commitments doesn't permit a hardcore approach. The frustration sometimes spills over

I guess we all have our frustrations eh!

still hopeful we can find an alternative for mumble because its still costing me $20/month with the webpage...but look no adds!

The only reason anyone ever wants people in the raid to shutup or seem to shoot people down revolves around the format. we are taking 20+ people and if we don't put a lid on chat, it gets chaotic and confusing for some people. I've talked to the officers and leaders and its certainly not anything personal - they all just want us to push on and have everyone know their role without confusion. In a smaller team your input would actually get more acknowledgement.

well fingers crossed tonight. i'm feeling good about it and pretty keen